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Jun. 11th, 2004 08:13 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
disneydream06Here is the response that ![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
bryen gave to an ultra conservatives thoughts that liberals should get out of the country. I would like to thank him for letting me steal it. I think as many people as we can get to read this the better. It is a little long so I will put it behind a cut but please read it. Thanks.
Do you really mean that?
If Bush/Falwell/Robertson/Dobson keep it up, you just might get your wish.
But do you really mean it? After all, one of the reasons that the US has been prosperous is that people have done exactly that to their former countries. The US has thrived on the castoffs of Nazis and Religious WackJob countries the world over !
As you believe the future to be, it won't be the drooling idiots who leave here when it happens, it will be folks creative and energetic enough to actually get up the balls to pull up roots and leave for another country, learn another language, make themselves part of another culture.
And look at cities around the US. It is the cities most welcoming to nonconformists and "alternative lifestyles" that are the most prosperous over the long run. The reason is very simple, it has been a LONG time since the US and "industrialized" world got by on pure muscle, or iron. Today supremacy is a matter of brains and innovation. That takes creativity.
Do you really want your wish?
Notice that the most poverty stricken and hideous armpits of the world like Afghanistan and MissaAlabamaLouisiana are the least innovative, most conservative and most religious. There is a correlation. (as to why maybe you are so protective of spelling and grammar, which you cannot spell yourself!)
Do you really want your wish ?
Is it not interesting that most liberals don't tell someone like Pat Robertson (or youself) that if you don't like NBC airing Queer Eye, or Massachusetts permitting equality that you should move to some hell pit like Iran?
Why is it *usually* the conservatives who say "Love It Or Leave It"? And then (ironically) the conservatives often have the biggest gripe-fests! But wait! I thought it was "Love It Or Leave It" !!
Its not about *persuading* people, its about keeping down alternative visions. Keeping people ignorant and scared and feeling dependent.
And when the "Army Of God" fear mongers win, that country goes STRAIGHT into the trashcan of history. Look at the Roman Empire; look at the European "Dark Ages". Notice that during Europe's Dark Ages it was the Islamic merchants and scholars who kept alive ideas like algebra and astronomy, philosophy etc. that later became the basis of the Renaissance! It was the Islamic empire that invented the zero and eyeglasses! And now THEY have fallen into a religious hell pit of theocracy.
If Pat Robertson and Jerry Fallwell and you get their (your) way, countless very creative people will be leaving the US. And then the US will get the same as happened to the Islamic Empire, Europe during Dark Ages and the Roman Empire.
When a few people use religion as a weapon in pursuit of secular worldly power (theocrats), everyone loses, including the theocrats. Don't forget that it was theocratic pressure on the Romans that resulted in the crucifixion of Jesus! It was not initiated by the (then) liberally polytheistic Roman Empire!
It was all downhill from there for a loooooong time.
bryen gave to an ultra conservatives thoughts that liberals should get out of the country. I would like to thank him for letting me steal it. I think as many people as we can get to read this the better. It is a little long so I will put it behind a cut but please read it. Thanks.Do you really mean that?
If Bush/Falwell/Robertson/Dobson keep it up, you just might get your wish.
But do you really mean it? After all, one of the reasons that the US has been prosperous is that people have done exactly that to their former countries. The US has thrived on the castoffs of Nazis and Religious WackJob countries the world over !
As you believe the future to be, it won't be the drooling idiots who leave here when it happens, it will be folks creative and energetic enough to actually get up the balls to pull up roots and leave for another country, learn another language, make themselves part of another culture.
And look at cities around the US. It is the cities most welcoming to nonconformists and "alternative lifestyles" that are the most prosperous over the long run. The reason is very simple, it has been a LONG time since the US and "industrialized" world got by on pure muscle, or iron. Today supremacy is a matter of brains and innovation. That takes creativity.
Do you really want your wish?
Notice that the most poverty stricken and hideous armpits of the world like Afghanistan and MissaAlabamaLouisiana are the least innovative, most conservative and most religious. There is a correlation. (as to why maybe you are so protective of spelling and grammar, which you cannot spell yourself!)
Do you really want your wish ?
Is it not interesting that most liberals don't tell someone like Pat Robertson (or youself) that if you don't like NBC airing Queer Eye, or Massachusetts permitting equality that you should move to some hell pit like Iran?
Why is it *usually* the conservatives who say "Love It Or Leave It"? And then (ironically) the conservatives often have the biggest gripe-fests! But wait! I thought it was "Love It Or Leave It" !!
Its not about *persuading* people, its about keeping down alternative visions. Keeping people ignorant and scared and feeling dependent.
And when the "Army Of God" fear mongers win, that country goes STRAIGHT into the trashcan of history. Look at the Roman Empire; look at the European "Dark Ages". Notice that during Europe's Dark Ages it was the Islamic merchants and scholars who kept alive ideas like algebra and astronomy, philosophy etc. that later became the basis of the Renaissance! It was the Islamic empire that invented the zero and eyeglasses! And now THEY have fallen into a religious hell pit of theocracy.
If Pat Robertson and Jerry Fallwell and you get their (your) way, countless very creative people will be leaving the US. And then the US will get the same as happened to the Islamic Empire, Europe during Dark Ages and the Roman Empire.
When a few people use religion as a weapon in pursuit of secular worldly power (theocrats), everyone loses, including the theocrats. Don't forget that it was theocratic pressure on the Romans that resulted in the crucifixion of Jesus! It was not initiated by the (then) liberally polytheistic Roman Empire!
It was all downhill from there for a loooooong time.
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no subject
Date: 2004-06-11 01:40 pm (UTC)I call myself the facilitator
Date: 2004-06-11 01:47 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-06-14 07:05 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-06-15 03:26 am (UTC)I think basically he is saying that as soon as someone complains about something in this country, the conservatives will start saying, If you don't like it you can move to another country. That seems to be their easy answer to everything. And in the past when that sort of thing has happened, the society in that country suffers from a lack of imagination. To put it simply.
I loved Dogma the movie. It was very funny. Of course I am not Catholic and don't have hangups about religion. lol... Without looking it up in the dictionary, I believe dogma means a thought process/ideology. Like in the movie, the Catholic "dogma" is their beliefs in religion. I think that is what it means.
So the dogma the person was talking about is the right wing conservative's thoughts about how this country should be.
I hope that helps you understand some of this?
Love and Hugs, Jon
no subject
Date: 2004-06-15 04:29 am (UTC)